Atheists - Morals??

[n0vembergirl]

This is to all those atheists out there..

How do you believe in morals? What would you say defines right and wrong?

[oceansbetweenus]

Morals aren't solely a part of religion. Right and wrong comes from ethics, empathy, human nature, your personal values, etc. I know that if something hurts somebody in some way, then it is more than likely wrong. I don't need fear of god/hell to spur my actions

[Mr_Quick]

From an evolutionary perspective, altruism and empathy have immense survival value for humans. A lone human is a comparatively weak and soft thing that could be picked off by almost any large predator; apart from our brains, it's our ability to get along with others and function in large groups that has enabled our species to survive and prosper.

From a psychological and anthropological perspective, concern for others' well-being and a desire to do "the right thing" are near-universal traits among humans, which have been observed and celebrated across the globe in virtually every society in the world irrespective of religious belief or non-belief.

From a neurological perspective, it has been demonstrated that empathy, compassion, and altruism are all governed by certain areas of the brain, and the expression of these traits in someone's personality can be altered, sometimes dramatically, by changes in brain chemistry or structure (such as those created by drug use or brain damage).

From a philosophical perspective, I suspect most atheists decide to behave morally out of some combination of self interest (they don't want to incite retaliation, provoke a conflict, or alienate others) and compassion (they want the people around them to be happy and free from suffering) depending on the person and the situation, just as we all do.

[I_Am_Once_Was]

To me it all stems from the fact that we're pack animals. Going all the way back to tribalism, a lot of the things we consider 'wrong' today would be a detriment to the tribe. The golden rule existed before it was ever said. It existed before humans existed.

[DisparityByDesign]

How do you believe in morals? What would you say defines right and wrong?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Normative_ethics

[jenjenxD]

I decide what's right and wrong using my judgement and experiences instead of following a book..

[MoralAtheist]

How do you believe in morals?

How? By believing in them, like everyone else.

What would you say defines right and wrong?

The dictionary has good definitions, none which have anything to do with religion or a lack of religion.

Although I'm not accusing the OP of anything, there is a common insulting assumption by theists in most religions that one cannot possibly have 'good' morals without the belief in their specific god.

[Giants55]

The one thing that drives me nuts about religious people is that they believe that without religion we wouldn't have morals. That is completely wrong and if you think that's right then you seriously need to evaluate your self as a person.

[Headcase-]

I have a pretty shaky moral compass at present, so I don't know how equipped I am to answer this.
But honestly? I've considered myself an atheist for a decade, and religion was never a part of my upbringing.
The concepts of right and wrong aren't things I struggle with.
That's not to say that I don't do things wrong; I do a ton of shit wrong.
But what is wrong vs. what is right is pretty evident to me regardless.

[ThatGirlKourtni]

This is my very favorite question ever directed to atheists because it makes no damn sense at all.

You can very well figure out what is "right" and what is "wrong" without a book telling you. Especially when that book tells you that slavery is okay, raping a woman is okay, but getting a haircut is not.

As you are a child, you are taught what is right and what is wrong, whether it be through religion or not. In my case, neither one of my parents identify as being very religious, so I was not raised through religion.

I do not need to go to church and read the Bible to know that killing someone is not okay.
I do not need to go to church and read the Bible to know that helping someone in need is a good/nice thing to do.
I do not need to go to church and read the Bible to know that rape is not okay, nor is selling humans as property.

I have every skill I need to be able to differentiate between right and wrong and I have never in my seventeen years of life used the Bible, church, God, or any other religiously affiliated subject to do so.

Basically what I'm saying is that the concept of what is right versus what is wrong does not come just from religion. People often use their religion as a way to help steer people into knowing what is right and wrong, but they could do it perfectly fine without religion.

[Stay-Gold]

Lack of religion or god=/= No moral character.
We don't go around committing crimes every Sunday instead of going to church.

Are you telling me that your parents are completely incapable of raising you to know right from wrong without telling you that you will go to hell if you do something wrong? lol

[Canadaluv]

Because its my emotions and humanity to not go kill and do illegal things in Christianity they killed people for no reason in
The crusades They had religion but not right morals. Bonobos Don't have religion but give food away to other monkeys that are strangers.

[khaligula]

Why are people arguing that morals are natural? Laws wouldn't exist if people behaved well just because, like lol...
but now that laws do exist, I can tell you that morals are unnecessary. People don't behave badly, atheist or otherwise, for a very good reason: They don't want to go to jail. I'm good with that.

[xSplicex]

Well, I will tell you every Atheist I know hasn't got into big crimes, or did anything worse than smoke weed. Judging by some others I met, I will tell you most are good people on their own without religion threatening them.

I won't kill people or animals, because I know they can feel pain. People may have family and friends who care about them. It would make me feel guilty. I don't need a religion to know that rape and stealing is a bad thing. It's taking from someone else to benefit your own desires. I don't sleep around, because I'd rather sleep with someone I love and be protected from getting STD's or pregnant from random people. Religion isn't the only thing people rely on for morals. I've met more Atheist with good intentions than some Christians I've met.

[khaligula]

xsplicex I'm sorry but your morals are explicitly based on a distinctly Judeo-Christian model. There is no doubt that a lot of the things we consider "good" or "bad" are based on the metaphysical framework of Christianity, which has become carefully embedded in our society. So, historically, yes, our morals depend on religion, whether you are atheist or not.

Ask a kid if he thinks that it's bad to take something because it's benefitting his own desires, he won't. He learns it's bad once we tell him and scold him for it... but why do we think that? If we are protagonists of our own life, why don't our desires trump other people's property? All that is based on an ethical code inherited from Christianity. I mean just the fact that you speak of engaging in monogamy as a moral act shows just how Christian your morals are, and you have the courage to say it is independent of religion?

People didn't quite grasp the meaning of OP's question. He's not asking you whether or not you have morals. Most people do. He's asking you: "Why?" We know why Christians do, they know that if they are not good, they will go to hell. Therefore, they have an incentive to act as good people... but why do atheists have morals? What are their incentives towards morality? The obvious implication is that a lot of so-called humanistic atheists are more sheepish than evangelical Christians, adopting a Judeo-Christian code of ethics without any legitimate reason for it.

[xSplicex]

xsplicex I'm sorry but your morals are explicitly based on a distinctly Judeo-Christian model. There is no doubt that a lot of the things we consider "good" or "bad" are based on the metaphysical framework of Christianity, which has become carefully embedded in our society. So, historically, yes, our morals depend on religion, whether you are atheist or not.

Ask a kid if he thinks that it's bad to take something because it's benefitting his own desires, he won't. He learns it's bad once we tell him and scold him for it... but why do we think that? If we are protagonists of our own life, why don't our desires trump other people's property? All that is based on an ethical code inherited from Christianity. I mean just the fact that you speak of engaging in monogamy as a moral act shows just how Christian your morals are, and you have the courage to say it is independent of religion?

People didn't quite grasp the meaning of OP's question. He's not asking you whether or not you have morals. Most people do. He's asking you: "Why?" We know why Christians do, they know that if they are not good, they will go to hell. Therefore, they have an incentive to act as good people... but why do atheists have morals? What are their incentives towards morality? The obvious implication is that a lot of so-called humanistic atheists are more sheepish than evangelical Christians, adopting a Judeo-Christian code of ethics without any legitimate reason for it.

You didn't seem to read why I have these morals. It's because I have the knowledge to know living beings around me can feel pain, and I shouldn't harm or kill them for this. They have families and friends that care about them, so why should I take from them for my own selfish reasons? I'm monogamous because I don't want to get STD's or pregnant by some guy I don't know, and be with someone I love. The Bible has nothing to do with with helping people, especially from what I read in the Old Testament. It's nothing but killing, rape, slavery, sexist, and racist. No, I'm not being rude at all, but people act if someone isn't a Christian, than they don't have morals. Are you saying that if these Christians didn't rely on what the churches tell them, that they'd go all crazy?

[AEDAN]

If you live in a modern Western society then you have been brought up in a culture which is deeply permeated a Judeo-Christian code of ethics. Thus, you have no basis for objectivity. You cannot describe yourself as an atheist who has adopted his own moral code, that moral code you call your own did not come to you through divine providence... it is a direct consequence of a society saturated with Biblical morale. Indeed, the very legal system used to maintain order still operates with Judeo-Christian ritualism.

If you want to know more about being an atheist, what being an atheist is and why people become atheists watch the following video on Atheism...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RW0...Q&feature=plcp

This goes some way to explaining all that atheism is.

[khaligula]

You didn't seem to read why I have these morals. It's because I have the knowledge to know living beings around me can feel pain, and I shouldn't harm or kill them for this. They have families and friends that care about them, so why should I take from them for my own selfish reasons? I'm monogamous because I don't want to get STD's or pregnant by some guy I don't know, and be with someone I love. The Bible has nothing to do with with helping people, especially from what I read in the Old Testament. It's nothing but killing, rape, slavery, sexist, and racist. No, I'm not being rude at all, but people act if someone isn't a Christian, than they don't have morals. Are you saying that if these Christians didn't rely on what the churches tell them, that they'd go all crazy?

You don't kill insects? You don't eat animals? Most people do. People have always displayed an inclination to put their own pleasure above the pain of others, even if they are aware of this pain. Hungry people will certainly put their hunger before yours. The sense of empathy people have will never trump their selfishness as we are creatures primarily interested in our own individual survival and pleasure. People kill their parents for inheritance, for fuck's sake, and you're trying to presume that identification and empathy can be the entire basis of an ethical code.

It is the bible that told people to behave, to be altruistic, to be "good" when law wasn't as efficient as it is today. It did so through promising the reward of heaven and through the fear of hell. This is what I have been saying. Christians have a logical reason to adopt a moral code: It comes with its own repercussions. Your moral code seems to be borne out of nothing but blind empathy for others. Why, as an individual, should the pain of others be a deterrent to your pleasure? Why should the fact that cows feel pain prevent me or you from eating a delicious steak? Why should I care? You care with no reason because you have blindly adopted a moral code along with a seemingly hyperactive sense of empathy (this may be the product of an overdeveloped superego, which will likely end up in neurosis). This goes back to OP's point: An atheist shouldn't have strong morals and humanistic atheists are irrational sheep.

[AEDAN]

If I were an atheist and wanted to undermine the fact that Christian ethics fostered our morality... I might argue that Christianity, a religion, an institutionalised dogma or ritualised and regulated behaviour is but an inevitable consequence of human socialisation. The fact our morals are derived from it is a rare dividend of a backward ideology from which our departure will only enhance our moral insight...

Still, this doesn't really underplay the significance of Christianity but it will sooth the anti-theist's ego.

[xSplicex]

If you live in a modern Western society then you have been brought up in a culture which is deeply permeated a Judeo-Christian code of ethics. Thus, you have no basis for objectivity. You cannot describe yourself as an atheist who has adopted his own moral code, that moral code you call your own did not come to you through divine providence... it is a direct consequence of a society saturated with Biblical morale. Indeed, the very legal system used to maintain order still operates with Judeo-Christian ritualism.

Being an Atheist is about not believing in a deity, or deities. No Atheist just say they don't believe in other things, like ghost, aliens, and other things. I'm sick of people just believing Christianity exist, and others don't have morals but Christians. Like I said, it seems like Atheist I've come across have a better heart and are better people than people who call themselves Christians. Yes, I said call themselves Christian for many reasons.*

You don't kill insects? You don't eat animals? Most people do. People have always displayed an inclination to put their own pleasure above the pain of others, even if they are aware of this pain. Hungry people will certainly put their hunger before yours. The sense of empathy people have will never trump their selfishness as we are creatures primarily interested in our own individual survival and pleasure. People kill their parents for inheritance, for fuck's sake, and you're trying to presume that identification and empathy can be the entire basis of an ethical code.

It is the bible that told people to behave, to be altruistic, to be "good" when law wasn't as efficient as it is today. It did so through promising the reward of heaven and through the fear of hell. This is what I have been saying. Christians have a logical reason to adopt a moral code: It comes with its own repercussions. Your moral code seems to be borne out of nothing but blind empathy for others. Why, as an individual, should the pain of others be a deterrent to your pleasure? Why should the fact that cows feel pain prevent me or you from eating a delicious steak? Why should I care? You care with no reason because you have blindly adopted a moral code along with a seemingly hyperactive sense of empathy (this may be the product of an overdeveloped superego, which will likely end up in neurosis). This goes back to OP's point: An atheist shouldn't have strong morals and humanistic atheists are irrational sheep.

I've been a vegetarian for 7 years, and reject leather, fur, and other things that kills animals. You're also saying without Christianity, that people can't feel for something. Are you saying that you're selfish and don't care about anyone else? The idea of religion is based out of fear, which is what my dad was telling me. He's not an Atheist and believes there is a possibly a higher being, but religion was created for fear. He believes that humans needed religion to be in fear of, or else they will go crazy. It's kind of like your theory in a way, and I do feel it does play a part in it. It doesn't mean me, or other Atheist aren't good people for the sake of being good. It's not because we're afraid to go to jail, or to a place like "Hell", it's because some of us really do care about others. Neither one of us are wrong, I can assure you that, because we're basing all of this off of our own theories. I can't speak for all Atheist, or all people who are religious, but I can speak for myself.