11-03-2009, 08:03 PM
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#101
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Pro-anti-anti-getsuga
Joined: Jan 2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schadenfreude-
I've already stated that I believe in the Theory of Evolution. I'm just stating now that it's not a definitve fact. But a very strong notion.
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In stating that you are completely incorrect, and further bolstering that you don't understand what the word theory means in this context or that the Theory of Evolution is a theory that explains how the real factual phenomenon known as evolution occurs.
http://www.sciencebuddies.org/mentor...ic_method2.gif
That outlines the scientific method. Step one is ask a question. You seem to think in the theory of evolution the question is "Does evolution occur?" when in fact the question is " HOW does evolution occur?"
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I was also hoping you could just run off human features that you feel have evolved that have been observed. I don't want to search that amazingly large site for them.
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Are you asking me for human features that evolved from another species? Or are you asking for human features that have evolved significantly from the start of the human species to today?
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Originally Posted by Bruce Lee
Empty your mind, be formless, shapeless, like water. You put watter into a bottle it becomes the bottle, you put it in a teapot it becomes the teapot. Water can flow, or it can crash. Be water, my friend.
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Think.
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11-03-2009, 08:13 PM
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#102
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Oooga Booga!
Joined: May 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nikias
Are you asking me for human features that evolved from another species? Or are you asking for human features that have evolved significantly from the start of the human species to today?
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Theories change. Which is why they aren't definitive facts. Similar, but to say a Theory = Fact is completely wrong. Show me a source that says a Theory is a fact. A Theory is similar to a general overview so all the facts used in them remain facts but don't make the theory a fact. Just a stronger argument.
And the latter please. Human features that have evolved from the start of human species to today. As this would be more obseravle and reliable.
See ya tomorow!
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11-03-2009, 08:30 PM
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#103
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Pro-anti-anti-getsuga
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I never said theory = fact, so you'd have to talk to whoever did. What I said is evolution is a theory and a fact.
As for the latter, I'm not a biologist, however some people on here are, so I'll see if someone else can help you, in the meantime I'll see if I can come up with anything.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bruce Lee
Empty your mind, be formless, shapeless, like water. You put watter into a bottle it becomes the bottle, you put it in a teapot it becomes the teapot. Water can flow, or it can crash. Be water, my friend.
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Think.
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11-03-2009, 09:26 PM
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#104
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Unregistered User
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schadenfreude-
Theories change. Which is why they aren't definitive facts. Similar, but to say a Theory = Fact is completely wrong. Show me a source that says a Theory is a fact. A Theory is similar to a general overview so all the facts used in them remain facts but don't make the theory a fact. Just a stronger argument.
And the latter please. Human features that have evolved from the start of human species to today. As this would be more obseravle and reliable.
See ya tomorow!
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You are the only one perpetuating this "theory is a fact" notion. It isn't. We know it isn't. It never was supposed to be. You have already quoted a definition that says a theory is never a fact, why is this still an issue?
And yet, contradictorily, you correctly understand a theory is an explanation of facts.
I'm amazed your mind makes sense to you. Unless you're just a good troll.
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“An intellectual is a person who has discovered something more interesting than sex.” - Aldous Huxley
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11-04-2009, 03:48 AM
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#105
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Registered User
Joined: Dec 2008
Location: United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schadenfreude-
Theories change. Which is why they aren't definitive facts. Similar, but to say a Theory = Fact is completely wrong. Show me a source that says a Theory is a fact. A Theory is similar to a general overview so all the facts used in them remain facts but don't make the theory a fact. Just a stronger argument.
And the latter please. Human features that have evolved from the start of human species to today. As this would be more obseravle and reliable.
See ya tomorow!
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body hair, different colored eyes and skin, immunities, etc.
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Vegeta, what does the scouter say about his power level ....
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11-04-2009, 12:08 PM
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#106
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Oooga Booga!
Joined: May 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cr0nu5
You are the only one perpetuating this "theory is a fact" notion. It isn't. We know it isn't. It never was supposed to be. You have already quoted a definition that says a theory is never a fact, why is this still an issue?
And yet, contradictorily, you correctly understand a theory is an explanation of facts.
I'm amazed your mind makes sense to you. Unless you're just a good troll.
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If I'm not mistaken you were one to agree with this 'Theory is a Fact' implementation. However I am not sure and I'm not going to review every comment made.
I made a simple comment. A Theory is not a fact. You disagreed strongly and this is why the discussion is taking place.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Whatevery0__
body hair, different colored eyes and skin, immunities, etc.
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And the thing is all of these can be explained in with other reasons as well.
However I didn't think eye colour was one. What makes you say that eye colour has evolved?
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11-04-2009, 12:14 PM
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#107
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Registered Something
Joined: Jan 2008
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Quote:
If I'm not mistaken you were one to agree with this 'Theory is a Fact' implementation. However I am not sure and I'm not going to review every comment made.
I made a simple comment. A Theory is not a fact. You disagreed strongly and this is why the discussion is taking place.
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Should we not be teaching the theory of gravity either?
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TSSP
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11-04-2009, 01:58 PM
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#108
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Oooga Booga!
Joined: May 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by amorphous
Should we not be teaching the theory of gravity either?
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Where did teaching come into this? Are you assuming that we only learn factual knowledge?
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11-04-2009, 02:06 PM
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#109
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Registered Something
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Ok, I was off base in that our discussion is about the facts of evolution rather than the teaching of it. Still, just because it's a "theory" does not make it less credible. The vast majority of scientists accept the concept of evolution as a fact - there is no debate in the scientific community over evolution. There's a debate over the role of various mechanisms - mutations, natural selection, genetic drift, etc - and the role that they play, but there is no debate about whether evolution occurs.
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11-04-2009, 02:07 PM
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#110
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Pro-anti-anti-getsuga
Joined: Jan 2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schadenfreude-
I made a simple comment. A Theory is not a fact. You disagreed strongly and this is why the discussion is taking place.
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Actually, I'm pretty sure it was this idiotic comment
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schadenfreude-
The Evolution Theory is a theory. A pretty strong theory. Stronger than the other theories about our creation. However still a theory. Scientists have proven nothing.
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That started this whole thing. The whole thing is pretty moronic but I bolded the dumbest of the claims you made in this post.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bruce Lee
Empty your mind, be formless, shapeless, like water. You put watter into a bottle it becomes the bottle, you put it in a teapot it becomes the teapot. Water can flow, or it can crash. Be water, my friend.
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Think.
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11-04-2009, 02:19 PM
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#111
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Oooga Booga!
Joined: May 2008
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And when did I say the Evolution wasn't credible?
An ostrich's eye is bigger that its brain. This can be proven time and time again. No one can logically debate it. It is therefore a fact.
The Theory of Evolution (How humans have come to be) is not a fact. It has convincing logcial facts and hypothesis. However it in itself can't be proven totally correct. Scientists still disagree and can find other explanations to contradict it.
Now I'm not saying it is wrong. And that it shouldn't be taught. But it shouldn't be seen as a fact since it simply isn't. Theories consistently change. Facts don't
See the difference.
Anyways it's quite obvious that you're not going to change and either am I. So we might as well drop it. Especially since no one has shown me how it is a fact. (Excluding Nikias)
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11-04-2009, 02:27 PM
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#112
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Pro-anti-anti-getsuga
Joined: Jan 2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schadenfreude-
And when did I say the Evolution wasn't credible?
An ostrich's eye is bigger that its brain. This can be proven time and time again. No one can logically debate it. It is therefore a fact.
The Theory of Evolution (How humans have come to be) is not a fact
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Stopped reading here. The theory of evolution is not the theory of how humans came to be, it's the theory of how humans evolved. That humans evolved is a fact.
It seems to just not get through your incredibly thick skull no matter how many times it's repeated, but I'll try again.
EVOLUTION IS A FACT. THE THEORY OF EVOLUTION IS A THEORY AS TO HOW EVOLUTION OCCURS, NOT IF IT OCCURS.
The part that changes is our understanding of how evolution occurs. The fact that evolution does occur has never changed.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bruce Lee
Empty your mind, be formless, shapeless, like water. You put watter into a bottle it becomes the bottle, you put it in a teapot it becomes the teapot. Water can flow, or it can crash. Be water, my friend.
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Think.
Last edited by Nikias : 11-04-2009 at 02:32 PM.
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11-04-2009, 02:29 PM
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#113
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Registered User
Joined: Jun 2006
Location: Canada
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you are still not understanding what the word "theory" means in science and that it simply cannot be called a "fact" by definition.
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So crucify the ego before it's far too late
To leave behind this place so negative and blind and cynical
And you will come to find that we are all one mind
Capable of all that's imagined and all conceivable.
Just let the light touch you and let the words spill through
Just let them pass right through, bringing out our hope and reason
- Tool
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11-04-2009, 06:50 PM
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#114
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Audentes Fortuna Iuvat
Joined: Aug 2005
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Schadenfreude-,
"Scientists most often use the word "fact" to describe an observation. But scientists can also use fact to mean something that has been tested or observed so many times that there is no longer a compelling reason to keep testing or looking for examples. The occurrence of evolution in this sense is fact. Scientists no longer question whether descent with modification occurred because the evidence is so strong."
- United States National Academy of Sciences
Regarding evolution that has occurred within the species Homo sapiens since its emergence, archaic Homo sapiens had thicker skulls, no prominent chin, more prominent brow ridges, and slightly higher body mass.
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And the thing is all of these can be explained in with other reasons as well.
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Not so much.
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However I didn't think eye color was one. What makes you say that eye color has evolved?
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The mutation for blue eyes first appeared only 6000-10000 years ago (for comparison, Homo sapiens has been around for 250000-400000 years). If I remember correctly, this determination was based on mtDNA studies.
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- Friedrich Nietzsche
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11-04-2009, 07:05 PM
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#115
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Unregistered User
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 3,244
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schadenfreude-
If I'm not mistaken you were one to agree with this 'Theory is a Fact' implementation. However I am not sure and I'm not going to review every comment made.
I made a simple comment. A Theory is not a fact. You disagreed strongly and this is why the discussion is taking place.
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I would like to see you quote me saying that.
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“An intellectual is a person who has discovered something more interesting than sex.” - Aldous Huxley
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11-04-2009, 08:11 PM
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#116
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Joined: Jun 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 28,729
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schadenfreude-
However I didn't think eye colour was one. What makes you say that eye colour has evolved?
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http://www.ku.dk/english/news/blue-eyes.htm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sexy-kt-17
And I'd like you to dexplain how DNA fits in with the theory of evolution
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so he stopped for a second, looked up at me and said in a really creepy voice, "I can has cheeseburger?" and then went back to eating me out.
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11-05-2009, 11:29 AM
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#117
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WHM
Joined: Jan 2005
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Quote:
Originally Posted by longhorn_fraz
The mutation for blue eyes first appeared only 6000-10000 years ago (for comparison, Homo sapiens has been around for 250000-400000 years). If I remember correctly, this determination was based on mtDNA studies.
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Not possible the earth is only 6,000 years old.
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11-05-2009, 03:59 PM
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#118
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Oooga Booga!
Joined: May 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by watchayakan
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It wasn't a bad article I will admit, but it didn't all make sense. Far too many claims with little back up. Though I have to appreciate it isn't a science journal as such.
How do we know what eye colours our ancestors had? As scientists still don't even know which genes are responsible for eye colour and what not. So DNA testing wouldn't really work well. Don't worry these aren't rhetorical questions this is something I'd actually like to know.
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11-05-2009, 04:25 PM
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#119
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Registered User
Joined: Dec 2008
Location: United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schadenfreude-
It wasn't a bad article I will admit, but it didn't all make sense. Far too many claims with little back up. Though I have to appreciate it isn't a science journal as such.
How do we know what eye colours our ancestors had? As scientists still don't even know which genes are responsible for eye colour and what not. So DNA testing wouldn't really work well. Don't worry these aren't rhetorical questions this is something I'd actually like to know.
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they do know what eye color our ancestors had and what genes are responsible. in fact, all that information can be found in that article you refused to understand. you must be a troll.
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11-05-2009, 05:54 PM
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#120
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Oooga Booga!
Joined: May 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Whatevery0__
they do know what eye color our ancestors had and what genes are responsible. in fact, all that information can be found in that article you refused to understand. you must be a troll.
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I didn't ask if they knew. I asked how they knew. And they don't know all the specific genes which are responsible. They just know it's a mix of genes one which they assume is oculocutaneous albinism 2; which come in many different varieties.
Like I said. How do they know that our ancestors only had brown eyes to begin with?
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